William Johnson - 20-05-2021 14:30:06
Hi everyone, I'm Will Johnson from the RIPE NCC. This chat panel is meant for discussion ONLY. If you have questions for the speaker and you want the session chair to read it out, please write it in the Q&A window also stating your affiliation. Otherwise, you can ask questions using the microphone icon.
Please note that all chat transcripts will be archived and made available to the public on https://ripe82.ripe.net/.
Michael Richardson - 20-05-2021 14:35:16
It's funny how cloud data condenses into lakes.
Blake Willis - 20-05-2021 14:41:48
Christian Teuschel - 20-05-2021 14:41:49
Massimo Candela - 20-05-2021 14:41:53
Thank you Emile for this update, I’m glad to see the system is improving further. RIPE RIS is a -fundamental- data source for many Internet players and definitely a great example of community service from RIPE NCC that not so many other organisations would have been able to make it happen. Thank you!
Lars Prehn - 20-05-2021 14:41:59
Mohamad Choaib - 20-05-2021 14:41:59
Thanks Emile !
Alastair Strachan - 20-05-2021 14:42:01
Marco Davids - 20-05-2021 14:42:07
Someone told me once: Tier-1 provider only receives money for IP-transit and never pays for it. Seemed like a nice definition.
Christian Adler - 20-05-2021 14:42:12
Luuk Hendriks - 20-05-2021 14:42:16
Peter Hessler - 20-05-2021 14:42:24
Hurricane, counts, of course.
Peter Hessler - 20-05-2021 14:42:34
Gert Doering - 20-05-2021 14:42:54
Tier-1 - too proud to pay someone to be able to provide a full Internet routing table to their customers
Blake Willis - 20-05-2021 14:42:57
Emile Aben - 20-05-2021 14:43:11
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tier_1_network ( and I'll be watching page edits :) )
Michael Richardson - 20-05-2021 14:43:13
@Marco, it is a nice definition. Many national ISPs think they are Tier-1, but often they aren't.
Blake Willis - 20-05-2021 14:43:41
"tier 1 in their markets" I like to say, as per drpeering
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 14:44:35
It appears the "questions" button is broken, please enter your questions in this chat until that gets fixed. Please prefix your question with "QUESTION:" so that we as chairs can identify who is in line
Peter Hessler - 20-05-2021 14:45:09
job, did that work?
Peter Hessler - 20-05-2021 14:45:43
you *have* to add the affiliation line, otherwise it gets grumpy
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 14:45:48
yes, that worked
Wolfgang Zenker - 20-05-2021 14:45:48
looks like it, question showed up for a moment
Alexander Zubkov - 20-05-2021 14:46:03
I do not see the question input field too, completely.
Menno Schepers - 20-05-2021 14:46:09
Job, in role of Chair and Speaker, you can't ask questions
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 14:46:14
Gert Doering - 20-05-2021 14:46:32
it's better if Job does not ask questions about RPKI
Gert Doering - 20-05-2021 14:46:36
Peter Hessler - 20-05-2021 14:46:37
Jan Žorž - 20-05-2021 14:46:39
Menno: why not?
Elvis Daniel Velea - 20-05-2021 14:46:40
Mohamad Choaib - 20-05-2021 14:46:50
Elvis Daniel Velea - 20-05-2021 14:46:52
he has the mic, he can always ask
Blake Willis - 20-05-2021 14:47:01
and the chair...
Jan Žorž - 20-05-2021 14:47:20
it's usual for chairs to ask questions, with appropriate "with my chair's hat off"
Jan Žorž - 20-05-2021 14:48:26
specially if there are no other questions :)
Elvis Daniel Velea - 20-05-2021 14:48:27
yeah, chairs should be able to take (some of) their clothes off while chairing, @menno - please add this to the requirements for the meetecho people
Niall O'Reilly - 20-05-2021 14:48:46
Platform feature; not commenting on whether it's a bug ...
Ondřej Caletka - 20-05-2021 14:48:57
I would prefer if chairs asked questions via audio/video. I would generally prefer audio/video questions.
Jan Žorž - 20-05-2021 14:49:31
Job: next time type your question into Q/A section and read it out :) :) :)
Oliver Payne - 20-05-2021 14:49:41
of course the chairs/speakers can still ask their questions out loud, but the Q&A tab for chairs becomes a lot busier already as they have extra buttons to manage the existing questions
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 14:49:52
could we please have the urls for rfc, cps, ... in the chat so they are clickable, which slides are not
Ties de Kock - 20-05-2021 14:50:34
@Randy: links are clickable in https://ripe82.ripe.net/wp-content/uploads/presentations/81-Routing-WG-RIPE82-Nathalie.pdf
Fergal Cunningham - 20-05-2021 14:50:50
Here is the CPs, Randy. https://www.ripe.net/publications/docs/ripe-751
Ties de Kock - 20-05-2021 14:51:01
(other sheet decks are at https://ripe82.ripe.net/programme/meeting-plan/routing-wg/)
Jen Linkova - 20-05-2021 14:51:03
Randy: why, don't you remember all those RFCs by heart???! ;))
Alexander Zubkov - 20-05-2021 14:51:31
He wants, but need a link.
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 14:51:40
i don;t want the rfcs, i wan the urls of the ncc compliance reports
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 14:51:56
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 14:51:58
i have all the rfcs themselves on my laptop
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 14:52:10
Michael Richardson - 20-05-2021 14:52:30
suddenly, lots of access to my.ripe.net from starbucks goes way up.
Marco van Tol - 20-05-2021 14:53:50
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 14:54:33
Information about the testbed is here: https://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/routing-wg/2021-May/004345.html
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 14:55:03
you can use the new repo by updating /etc/hosts to point rpki.ripe.net to the IPs of rpki2.ripe.net
Robert Scheck - 20-05-2021 14:55:30
Why do I only read "AWS" when RIPE NCC talks about "cloud"?
Alex Band - 20-05-2021 14:56:01
How krill-sync works: https://github.com/NLnetLabs/krill-sync#introduction
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 14:56:22
@robert: the ncc has fully swollowed the amazon koolaid
Robert Scheck - 20-05-2021 14:56:38
Did the RIPE NCC hire AWS consultants and fan persons? Is there no other cloud provider except AWS?
Blake Willis - 20-05-2021 14:57:01
"The Internet" actually means "us-east-1", y'all didn't get the memo?
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 14:57:02
you missed the discussion yesterday. it was an AWS sales preso
Jan Žorž - 20-05-2021 14:57:06
this question was discussed at length in services WG
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 14:57:31
no, @jan, it was presented, not much discussed
Jan Žorž - 20-05-2021 14:57:38
Gert Doering - 20-05-2021 14:58:27
I seem to have an insight. This is to avoid the yearly payback to the members, which is always a discussion / voting issue! With AWS, there will never be any money left.
Jan Žorž - 20-05-2021 14:58:48
Hans Petter Holen - 20-05-2021 14:58:48
Funny, or not.
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 14:58:53
let's focus on RPKI for now
Peter Hessler - 20-05-2021 14:58:55
Robert Scheck - 20-05-2021 14:58:57
But could be true, Gert!
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 14:59:59
aside from the expurgated text (wtf?) the rfc compliance reports look really worthwhile.
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:00:24
the redacted text will be published after the red team excercise I believe
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:00:34
more in a few months
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 15:00:47
Hans Petter Holen - 20-05-2021 15:00:48
@Randy / @Robert: I believe we presented yesterday that we have evaluated the available providers and are working with aws and gcp.
Mikhail Puzanov - 20-05-2021 15:00:49
@randy, @job After pentest, if I'm not mistaken
Felipe Victolla Silveira - 20-05-2021 15:01:13
@Randy Parts of the texts were redacted for security reasons. They expose areas of the code that should be further explored in a penetration testing
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:02:53
Erik - the testbed went live ... 45 minutes ago
Blake Willis - 20-05-2021 15:03:07
Peter Hessler - 20-05-2021 15:03:33
@Blake it's still funny :)
Blake Willis - 20-05-2021 15:03:46
& still true :-)
Benno Overeinder - 20-05-2021 15:04:06
Thanks Nathalie! Just curious. :-)
Daniel Karrenberg - 20-05-2021 15:05:44
Erik Bais - 20-05-2021 15:07:04
Thanks Natalie. 👏🏻
Blake Willis - 20-05-2021 15:07:15
Dmitry Kohmanyuk - 20-05-2021 15:07:55
https://honestnetworker.net/2020/10/22/developing-the-rpki-asn-1-ber-decoder/ Even better
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 15:08:15
that they are two planes is by design, the redundancy is the core of the verification
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:09:19
i agree, that is the characteristic that increases robustness. it is a form of 'double confirmation': you have to make the mistake both in BGP and in RPKI
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 15:09:40
trust me; i can make both mistakes at once :)
Florian Streibelt - 20-05-2021 15:09:56
@Job good we have automation for making the mistakes at least consistent :D
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:10:01
Daniel Karrenberg - 20-05-2021 15:10:14
Nathalie Trenaman - 20-05-2021 15:10:51
just finished reading the chat after my presentation :D chatty bunch
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:10:51
Four Stages of ROA vs 5 stages of grief
Dmitry Kohmanyuk - 20-05-2021 15:17:00
The acceptance is last one?
Blake Willis - 20-05-2021 15:17:04
Marcin Mikielewicz - 20-05-2021 15:17:08
Paul Hoogsteder - 20-05-2021 15:17:15
I noticed a voice request from Randy but it was gone before I could do anything with it.
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 15:17:19
@chairs: you are not watching the audio queue
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:19:51
my apologies for missing that
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 15:21:03
you can send the refund to RGnet's abuse mailbox
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:24:07
buy 4, get 0.23 free :)
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 15:24:49
how to monitor and how to ameliorate?
Lars Prehn - 20-05-2021 15:25:18
100.000 responses for 4 requests sounds like a declaration of war :D
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:26:55
maybe in and out a VRFs?
Gert Doering - 20-05-2021 15:27:09
along a mpls lsp would be my guess
Mohamad Choaib - 20-05-2021 15:27:11
Hans Westerbeek - 20-05-2021 15:27:12
Ivan Beveridge - 20-05-2021 15:27:14
Wolfgang Tremmel - 20-05-2021 15:28:53
what happened to "traceroute bad.horse" ?
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:29:03
i see people in audio queue
Christian Bretterhofer - 20-05-2021 15:29:07
verbessern improve, enhance, better, upgrade, correct, ameliorate
Andy Davidson - 20-05-2021 15:29:10
it rode off, Wolfgang
Ondřej Caletka - 20-05-2021 15:29:30
The best traceroute hack is treaceroute Tetris: https://milek7.pl/tracehack/
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:29:30
we can hear you
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:29:33
ask your question
Kurt Kayser - 20-05-2021 15:29:48
but he cannot hear us..
Paul Hoogsteder - 20-05-2021 15:31:52
We have to close the Q&A queue
Marco d'Itri - 20-05-2021 15:32:01
In my case all the loops reported by qrator were caused by a quagga (?) bug which somehow lost withdrawals
Job Snijders - 20-05-2021 15:32:24
Peter Hessler - 20-05-2021 15:33:48
xmas.futile.net is the christmas tree AS
Gert Doering - 20-05-2021 15:34:13
kaput from here
Gert Doering - 20-05-2021 15:34:18
it loops without a tree
Peter Hessler - 20-05-2021 15:34:27
it isn't xmas though
Lars Prehn - 20-05-2021 15:34:49
Andreas Härpfer - 20-05-2021 15:35:04
/me wondering if there are more loops in v4 than in v6 … or the other way round?
Daniel Karrenberg - 20-05-2021 15:35:05
Dimitry: traceroute 18.104.22.168
Cristel Pelsser - 20-05-2021 15:35:12
With Julian Del Fiore we came up with a technique to distinguish load balancing from detours
Cristel Pelsser - 20-05-2021 15:35:46
see here https://clarinet.u-strasbg.fr/~pelsser/publications/Del-Fiore-detours-tnsm2021.pdf
Daniel Karrenberg - 20-05-2021 15:35:47
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 15:35:49
@cristel: cite please
Randy Bush - 20-05-2021 15:36:00
small minds think alike :)
William Johnson - 20-05-2021 15:36:10
This session has now ended. The next session is Database and it will start at 1600 (UTC+2). More info on the RIPE 82 meeting plan: https://ripe82.ripe.net/programme/meeting-plan/