Ferenc Csorba - 19-05-2021 16:00:47
Hi everyone, I'm Ferenc Csorba from the RIPE NCC. This chat panel is meant for discussion ONLY. If you have questions for the speaker and you want it read out, please write it in the Q&A window also stating your affiliation. Otherwise, you can ask questions using the microphone icon. Please note that all chat transcripts will be archived and made available to the public on https://ripe82.ripe.net/.
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:00:49
Martin this should do it for you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEPwkeXsQWw&list=PLTYQO37E44geaaaj2jmV_7_Aw8ri1f2CM
Brian Nisbet - 19-05-2021 16:01:44
What? But I've been sitting in a different seat every day and plugging my laptop in and out at the end of ever session!
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:02:19
But I still had to queue for the buffet & coffee...
Brian Nisbet - 19-05-2021 16:02:41
You had a buffet?!
Martin Topholm - 19-05-2021 16:02:49
Thank you for the music tips.
Remco van Zuijlen - 19-05-2021 16:02:58
The line at the toilets were terrible
Wessel Sandkuijl - 19-05-2021 16:03:15
Coffee also was so-so
Erik Bais - 19-05-2021 16:03:29
Try a better office Wessel .. ;)
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:03:57
@Erik do you define office-quality by the coffee?
Olivia Mijnals-Ruimwijk - 19-05-2021 16:03:57
Olivia Ruimwijk is scribing
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:04:00
the cookies were better at the last RIPE meeting
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:04:27
@Kurt, of course
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:04:37
who doesn't rank office quality on coffee quality :)
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:04:46
@kurt: is there a different metric than "coffee and wifi quality"?
Erik Bais - 19-05-2021 16:05:02
Gert : my adblocker is blocking the cookies ..
Peter Hessler - 19-05-2021 16:05:11
noise, and quality of your neighbors
Erik Bais - 19-05-2021 16:05:33
Kurt Kayser : don't you ?
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:06:25
@Erik: I found some of the best companies I've worked for in 30years that had actually the worst coffee..
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:06:30
@erik: I'd complain to office management about that
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:07:04
DIY, bring your own fresh ground :p
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:07:11
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:07:20
@kurt: but you have been working for companies that had no IPv6 in their network, so if that's the baseline, "bad coffee" is just a minor aspect
Piotr Strzyżewski - 19-05-2021 16:07:29
I solved this by bringing my own coffee and french press :)
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:07:52
& you need the coffee to get the IPv6 working :-)
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:08:08
@Gert: if you define good company = has v6 in the net, then there are not too many (yet)..
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:09:44
@kurt: I've always been able to fix that part :-) - fix the coffee part is harder
Randy Bush - 19-05-2021 16:12:34
one can have successful islands of good coffee. islands of working IPvX don't work.
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:13:34
Yeah.. more v4.. happy LIRs..
Hervé Clément - 19-05-2021 16:17:58
@ Piotr: french press ?
Job Snijders - 19-05-2021 16:18:45
Between K-root and the RIPE NCC IRR database I don't think there ever has been s a situation where it would be acceptable for RIPE NCC to be down for a month?
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:19:15
these professional certs are excellent, would love to see more. I recommend them to people all the time
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:19:54
Surely the NCC is meant to set an example and lead the way, so I'm not sure why a month long outage was even being considered
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:19:58
Ulka Athale - 19-05-2021 16:20:18
If anyone is curious about what the IPv6 Security Expert exam will test: https://www.ripe.net/support/certified-professionals/ipv6-security-expert-exam
Piotr Strzyżewski - 19-05-2021 16:20:45
Wessel Sandkuijl - 19-05-2021 16:21:27
Job/Harry: I believe Hans meant that the _people_ would be gone, the services would still be online
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:21:53
But surely the people are still needed - especially for manual issues
Wessel Sandkuijl - 19-05-2021 16:22:03
Rumy Kanis - 19-05-2021 16:22:05
@Blake: more are being developed! Thank you for spreading the joy :)
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:22:12
No, that was about "20 years ago, the Internet would just chug along, even if the NCC went to the beach for a month"
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:23:51
I support the question of Elvis in the Q+A section!
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:24:02
the TTS is still broken.
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:24:25
to save folks from finding it: https://labs.ripe.net/author/athina/caught-in-the-middle-regulatory-impact-and-our-mission-as-the-ripe-ncc/
Carsten Schiefner - 19-05-2021 16:24:37
+1 to Kurt wrt. Elvis' Q.
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:24:55
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:27:42
+1 to Elvis
Peter Hessler - 19-05-2021 16:28:50
zendesk is the utter worst
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:29:05
Felipe promised that 2+ years ago
Elvis Daniel Velea - 19-05-2021 16:29:11
it's what the RIPE NCC has been used for years
Marco d'Itri - 19-05-2021 16:29:12
is zendesk stll unable to manage theading?
Dmitry Kohmanyuk - 19-05-2021 16:29:57
it is also probably not 100% GDPR compliant, being US company after all (or you have to pay extra)
Robert Scheck - 19-05-2021 16:29:57
Is Zendesk still Legacy-IP only?
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:30:06
ah, threading. I would be happy if I could just *look* at my tickets in the LIR portal, instead of just using it for attachment upload
Peter Hessler - 19-05-2021 16:30:34
@robert yes, ipv4 only
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:31:08
@robert: this has nothing to do with the usability
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:31:16
a simple grafana dashboard might be sufficient...
Robert Scheck - 19-05-2021 16:31:39
@Kurt: Nothing with the usability, yes, but the NCC could poke them as a paying customer?
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:33:04
I would assume a better ticket integration in the LIR portal would ease the Hostmaster-workload?!
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:35:06
excuses... either it's a policy or not...
Sascha Lenz - 19-05-2021 16:35:11
why is it not an option? weird answer I'm afraid
Sascha Lenz - 19-05-2021 16:35:15
Peter Hessler - 19-05-2021 16:35:23
I think I'm just going to stop using the v4 only services
Christian Bretterhofer - 19-05-2021 16:35:49
Webservices should be easy to be dualstacked, at minimum with proxys
Christian Bretterhofer - 19-05-2021 16:36:12
maybe run them on IPv6 only would be better
Peter Hessler - 19-05-2021 16:36:21
@Christian having been involved in that in the past, it is remarkably hard for legacy webservices.
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:36:33
would be really nice to see a cloud provider based in the NCC services region
Peter Hessler - 19-05-2021 16:36:59
like, I agree that their options are limited, but also, it's been how many years we've been shouting about that?
Sascha Lenz - 19-05-2021 16:37:00
"cloud" doesn't necessarily mean "public cloud" btw... just saying
Robert Scheck - 19-05-2021 16:37:32
At RIPE81 "cloud" felt like "AWS"
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:37:35
Sascha +1, just need somebody else to provide & maintain computing resources
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:37:36
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:37:48
I've done my part of the shouting (and will keep going)
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:38:06
+1 Robert, it felt like the decision to move to AWS had already been made
Sascha Lenz - 19-05-2021 16:38:08
yep, that's what the RIPE NCC seems to mean, AWS, for whatever reason. I'm pretty worried about the decsion process, but that's a bit offtopic atm
Randy Bush - 19-05-2021 16:38:10
multi-cloud to prevent lock-in nd to provide diversity
Sascha Lenz - 19-05-2021 16:38:22
Robert Scheck - 19-05-2021 16:38:29
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:38:44
much worse: instead of using EC2 as a building block, the vendor lock in was being made real by using lots of AWS services
Rob Evans - 19-05-2021 16:39:51
As we're running a little bit behind, we'll have a 10 minute break after Felipe and before Kaveh.
Randy Bush - 19-05-2021 16:39:53
aws lockin is really really dangerous
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:40:20
@rob can you play felipe at kurtis-speed?
Randy Bush - 19-05-2021 16:40:51
are there no emea cloud providers? yandex? who else?
Rob Evans - 19-05-2021 16:40:54
Not pre-recorded I'm afraid. :-)
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:41:08
@Randy - plenty
Brian Nisbet - 19-05-2021 16:41:13
I am now listening to all my podcasts at x1.5 speed, it makes me feel like I'm always listening to Kurtis, possibly with him doing different accents. :)
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:41:14
scaleway, OVH, Ikoula
Randy Bush - 19-05-2021 16:41:22
i try to shop locally
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:41:35
Kurt Erik Lindqvist - 19-05-2021 16:41:51
@Brian I see a business opportunity here....;-)
Brian Nisbet - 19-05-2021 16:42:02
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:42:15
James Kennedy - 19-05-2021 16:42:26
Rob Evans - 19-05-2021 16:42:31
What if you're listening to a LINX podcast with Kurtis?
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:42:41
@brian haha :-)
Chris Buckridge - 19-05-2021 16:42:58
@Rob strap in!
Brian Nisbet - 19-05-2021 16:43:13
@Rob Ludicrous speed!
Carsten Schiefner - 19-05-2021 16:43:18
[wrt. Kurtis) LOL! :-D
Peter Hessler - 19-05-2021 16:43:23
they've gone to plaid!
Daniel Karrenberg - 19-05-2021 16:43:29
Felipe can do Kurtis speed ..... en Espaol.
Carsten Schiefner - 19-05-2021 16:43:43
@Daniel No doubts. :-)
Piotr Strzyżewski - 19-05-2021 16:44:15
@Daniel Spanish or Portuguese?
Daniel Karrenberg - 19-05-2021 16:44:25
Daniel Karrenberg - 19-05-2021 16:44:50
I have not tried speaking Portugese with him yet.
João Luis Silva Damas - 19-05-2021 16:44:54
i thought filipe was brasilian,
Piotr Strzyżewski - 19-05-2021 16:44:57
I was so sure he is from Brazil
Daniel Karrenberg - 19-05-2021 16:45:13
He spanish is mucho mejor than mine.
Piotr Strzyżewski - 19-05-2021 16:45:24
Muy bien ;-)
Carsten Schiefner - 19-05-2021 16:45:33
being brazilian and speaking spanish fluently seems to be no contradiction...
João Luis Silva Damas - 19-05-2021 16:46:46
Daniel Karrenberg - 19-05-2021 16:47:36
@randy about European cloud providers: this depends on your definition of 'cloud'. As some other people have said the abstraction you choose is critical. And of course the big-<low number> will always offer an abstraction that is hard to refuse ......
Daniel Karrenberg - 19-05-2021 16:49:01
OK. My whole point was to defend Felipe speaking a language other than his native one and doing so very very clearly. Not everyone is a Kurtis.
Randy Bush - 19-05-2021 16:49:40
@dfk: which is a major reason i push multi-provider. preventing lock-in
Daniel Karrenberg - 19-05-2021 16:50:07
@randy:mkes sens to me ...
Andreas Härpfer - 19-05-2021 16:50:38
Also, availability/reliability differs drastically with European providers … and in a lot of cases does not nearly match that of the big US ones.
Randy Bush - 19-05-2021 16:51:14
the internet is about providing reliable service using unreliable components
Peter Hessler - 19-05-2021 16:51:15
as long as the datacenter doesn't catch on fire, the availability should be fine...
Andreas Härpfer - 19-05-2021 16:51:54
@Daniel What level of abstraction does the NCC need? Are we talking bare metal, VMs, or even managed K8s …
Daniel Karrenberg - 19-05-2021 16:52:27
@andreas: good question. "need" is the operative word here.
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:52:36
the last presentation says "Validation sessions with AWS Solution Architects to discuss best practices on Cloud principles and best-fit AWS services" so I'd presume they're going all in
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 16:52:57
gotta call Corey Quinn
Harry Cross - 19-05-2021 16:53:27
@Daniel - https://ripe81.ripe.net/wp-content/uploads/presentations/64-RIPE-81-RIPE-DB-RC-Cloud-PoC-Sander-Buskens-.pdf see page 9
Peter Hessler - 19-05-2021 16:53:27
oof, that's mean ;)
Ties de Kock - 19-05-2021 16:53:41
@Harry: Thanks for the link
Gert Doering - 19-05-2021 16:56:06
I second what Rudiger says. Operational tickets (DNS robot and such) can take agemonths to go nowhere...
Peter Hessler - 19-05-2021 16:57:54
"your call is important to us, please stay on the line"
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 16:58:26
or, please press 7 to upgrade your SLA to silver or gold
Daniel Karrenberg - 19-05-2021 16:58:30
@harry: that does not speak to 'need'. and that's the last i am going to say about this in this char.
Randy Bush - 19-05-2021 16:58:33
i can write a robot to see that you get a reply in one day. the SLA should be to resolution or at least signiificant steps to it.
Randy Bush - 19-05-2021 16:59:42
it had not occurred to me that my network could take weekends and holidays.
Daniel Karrenberg - 19-05-2021 16:59:56
@randy: yep. i remember that decades ago Xerox sent us a janitor because the SLA was 'Xerox personnel on site within n hours'.
Blake Willis - 19-05-2021 17:00:53
gotta drop, great discussion thans
Wolfgang Tremmel - 19-05-2021 17:01:21
seen a lot of SLAs not worth the paper they are written on.
James Kennedy - 19-05-2021 17:01:31
Kurt Kayser - 19-05-2021 17:01:33
"Investigation" sounds very official - i.e. from police or court.. but I believe this is meant just internally to clarify documents. I guess.
Piotr Strzyżewski - 19-05-2021 17:01:36
@Daniel rotfl :D
Ferenc Csorba - 19-05-2021 17:01:36
This session has now ended. The RIPE NCC Services WG meeting will continue at 17:10 (after the coffee break). More info on the RIPE 82 meeting plan: https://ripe82.ripe.net/programme/meeting-plan/